Constitutional Crisis hits the US Supreme Court

Really, I don't care; so yes, yes he is.

---Uncle MythMan (http://www.geocities.com/jmythh2k5) & the Xombies Help You with Money, Love, God etc. Use Your Evolved Mind & GET PAID BY SAVING THE DIALOG STARTERS!

He isn't Muslim either.
He is Christian.
http://www.barackobama.com/factcheck/2007/11/12/obama_has_never_been_a_muslim_1.php

Reverand Conner

I don't think Obama's own "fact-check" is a reliable source of information. His site claims that Obama was "never a Muslim."

But there is a lot of evidence that seems to prove otherwise.

This is from a New York Times article, Obama: Man of the World:

"He once got in trouble for making faces during Koran study classes in his elementary school, but a president is less likely to stereotype Muslims as fanatics -- and more likely to be aware of their nationalism -- if he once studied the Koran with them.

Mr. Obama recalled the opening lines of the Arabic call to prayer, reciting them with a first-rate accent. In a remark that seemed delightfully uncalculated (it'll give Alabama voters heart attacks), Mr. Obama described the call to prayer as 'one of the prettiest sounds on Earth at sunset.'" (emphasis added in italics)

What are the words of the call to prayer?

"Allah is Great" (x4)
"I bear witness that there is no god except the One God (Allah)." (x2)
"I bear witness that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah." (x2)
"Hurry to the prayer (Rise up for prayer)." (x2)
"Hurry to success (Rise up for Salvation)." (x2)
"Allah is Great." (x2)
"There is no god except the One God (Allah)."

And on his school application in Indonesia, his religion was listed as Muslim. His step-father at the time also happened to be Muslim.

His father was Muslim too.

For Obama to claim that he was "never a Muslim" is a real stretch of the imagination. I really don't care if he was or not, but there's no reason to try to lie about it or pretend you've never had anything to do with it. He isn't a Muslim today (as far as we know), so what's the point of trying to bury it? Why does he always have to hide from his past? What's with all the secrets and denials?

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I care, mythman. And I think a lot of citizens should care. The question is, do the courts care?

The "vault" birth certificate is important because it will tell us whether or not Obama was actually born in Hawaii. If he was not, then the "natural-born" status would be in serious question. But getting Obama to release something as benign as a birth certificate is like trying to milk a rodeo bull.

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You-, I- and probably every thinking person-KNOWS that true Islam is based in peace (coming from the root-word- and typical-farewell-of muslims, "~salaam~" - meaning something like 'prosperous peace.')

But the public eye is not the 'persons'' eye, it's the people's eye---"... *a person* is smart; 'people' are dumb, and they'll believe anything ...

---Uncle MythMan (http://www.geocities.com/jmythh2k5) & the Xombies Help You with Money, Love, God etc. Use Your Evolved Mind & GET PAID BY SAVING THE DIALOG STARTERS!

I used to draw the natzi symbols on my paper some of them with daggers and blood dripping from them on my papers, and I'm not a natzi and never have been. Instead I of that, if you had been there you would have found that I was just one of the odd balls in school who liked to be the center of attention. It could be that our new President was just shy, not very outgoing as a youth and thought making faces and looking funny would bring him some wanted attention.

To make assumptions based on what he was like as a youth is preposterous. Our childhood is an important growing period, where w learn to be who we are. It is were we learn about dealing with feelings of inadequecies and more.

Even if he ever was a muslim, maybe he has some resentment towards some people who didn't treat him right, but I doubt that. I don't believe he ever was.

Maybe he wanted to learn more about Muslims at one time due to curiosity or that he had Muslim friends or whatever. That doesn't make Obama a Muslim. Having muslim friends doesn't make him one either. I have muslim friends, and I am not muslim. I have friends who claim they are vampires, I am not one.

I study all religions and can quote the bible word for word, but I am not Christian and never have been. My mother would like to think that I was, but in high school even though I attended church with my sisters, I was into gothism and witchcraft. These days I'm a Wiccan. I don't practice witchcraft anymore, and have grown up a lot.

I think your concern is a little over the top here. What I am trying to say, is you are making a mountain out of a mole hill.

Reverand Conner

It wasn't my "concern" that he was a Muslim. I was addressing what his website said - which was that he was "never a Muslim." Throughout his entire presidential campaign, he and his associates had to denounce, deny, and ignore anything that was brought up about his past. I have repeatedly stated that I don't think he is a Muslim today and I really don't care if he was in the past.

But for he and his campaign to lie about something as trivial as what religion he practiced as a child or to try to pretend that it was never a part of his life, I think is pretty pathetic and raises some questions about his character.

I'm not making a "mountain" out of anything. Though I do think you have yet to comprehend a word I have written.

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Seeing how true Islam is based in peace, there isn't much anachy in that.

However you are right about smart people being dumb to a point, not all smart people believe anything that is told them. After all, do you catagorize yourself as smart or dumb? If you consider yourself a smart person than you have just laid your own snare. I hope you do consider yourself smart though because the very fact that you have a unique opinion show inteligence.

Now it is how we use our inteligence I think that is important. Do we use it for our own personal gain or for the good of the many? I must not be very smart in this area, because I choos the good of the other, and I am so poverty stricken it isn't funny. Good news is I have a cat, a pretty lifepartner, and a house to live in. Things could be worse.

But back on topic. You can be smart but highly impressionable. You can be dumb as mud yet as stuborn as a bull. Or you can be smart and as stuborn as a mule, in which case you might have a reason to be stuborn. Yet dumb people who are dumb will usually fall on their haunches eventuall, and if they don't they are very well loved by that which made us.

A truely smart person will have facts to support their theories or case. One that isn't so smart is going to go on what rumor has told them.

Reverand Conner

I don't know what church are u a reverand of? It can't have anything to do with the one true God, and no Allah is not his prohet.

The One true God, Geebius, smiles down us all. :)

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He looks down on us all. just as HE looked down from heaven on the masses that crucified, spat on, tore the flesh from, and pierced the hands and feet of Jesus. Does your confused brain think he was smiling then? could you smile if your only son was being murdered in front of you? I know not. Do you he think He smiles down on people that murder, rape, sodomize? Do you think He looks down at thousands upon thousands of His ceations being aborted every month in this country and smiles? If you do, you don't know the one true God either. When you stand before Him, He will let you know if you knew Him or not. You and the people that think with this whole world new age church bull crap have a sad day ahead of you.

You are wayyyyy too serious, vbm. Try to take the comment in the spirit it was intended and lighten up.

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there is nothing light or silly or laughable about them.

I am a Reverend with the Universal Life Church. The Universal Life Church doesn't just teach Christianity. For more information you should check out there site http://www.themonastery.org/?destination=aboutUs

I'm a Wiccan Reverend, not Christian, but I do teach Christianity, Islam, Buddhism, Taoism, and more. Does that answer your question what church I am a Reverend with?

http://www.xomba.com/user/lee1973
Reverand Conner

and that is all. There aren't that many gods to worship. You have no place in the pulpit/

Islam and salaam both come from the same 'root' slm (salama). Islam means submission and Salaam means peace. The common greeting is 'Alsalaam(u) Alaykum' or 'Peace (be) upon you' and the traditional goodbye is Ma'a Salaama or 'with peace'

Get Your Allah Gear HERE!

Vbm wrote: "You and the people that think with this whole world new age church bull crap have a sad day ahead of you.

Again, you are not the decision maker nor do you know what is going to happen. Please do not force your beliefs on others as an absolute truth, prediction or outcome.

It is nice that you feel impelled to defend your belief of who and what God is doing, but please have respect for other when doing it. Treat others as you would want to be treated.

I am a controversy.
MJ

I undestand God's word. It is pure and truth. It is not wishy washy, there is no error. He makes the decisions. I only try to open the eyes of the blinded ones. No allah, no buddah, no mormon. God speaks of only one, Jesus; the Truth, The Light, and the Way.

.....Mr Obama is a natural born AMERICAN citizen.

What's all the fuss about? Was there this much bother when Kennedy got in?

Some sayings come to mind about now...

"You protest too much"

"The one who smelt it, dealt it"

"You can catch more flies with honey than with salt" or however that one goes. :-)

I get the impression that you are trying to convince yourself that God is "it"...

Demanding others to accept your beliefs is not a conducive approach if you are trying to open their eyes. If you treat others with harshness, you will get harshness back or simply be ignored. If you are ignored, what have you accomplished? You have turned people in the opposite direction. Instead of opening their eyes to the Lord, you have closed their eyes, ears and hearts.

All I'm saying is, "Relax man, don't take life so seriously."

I am a controversy.
MJ

'VBM is the defining power. None of us were there when God created the earth, but VBM was. VBM was God's contractor on the job; it was VBM who told the firmament on the deep, "Hitherto shalt thou come, but no further." And God replied, "But all my rowdy friends're comin` over tonight! ... -eth"'

I hope you caught the sarcasm there; God is beyond all powers, beyond all king, beyond the limits of all created things---no human can comprehend the full truth of God ... and really, no human should want to.

---Uncle MythMan (http://www.geocities.com/jmythh2k5) & the Xombies Help You with Money, Love, God etc. Use Your Evolved Mind & GET PAID BY SAVING THE DIALOG STARTERS!

He has many names, too painful to hear or see, but we call him Bunkee.

He has a face that's just like his brother's, but with more charisma (think of an arched eyebrow).

When Geebius isn't smiling, Bunkee is; this reminds some of us of Geebius's smile, others are too negative to remember such.

---Uncle MythMan (http://www.geocities.com/jmythh2k5) & the Xombies Help You with Money, Love, God etc. Use Your Evolved Mind & GET PAID BY SAVING THE DIALOG STARTERS!

I forget the name of the lecturer in the series on the history of language, but he made it clear that most languages are 'dialects that begin as creoles'---from the first 'grunting differently to indicate different messages' to 'subcontinent slaves shipped to- and made to work in-areas speaking "enlightened" languages.'

For more about the development of language, check out the most-supercalifragilisticexpialidocious linguist I've ever met as she explains the scrumtrilescent evolution of our favorite words.

---Uncle MythMan (http://www.geocities.com/jmythh2k5) & the Xombies Help You with Money, Love, God etc. Use Your Evolved Mind & GET PAID BY SAVING THE DIALOG STARTERS!

P.S. And you can go ahead and call me a 'cunning linguist' if you find that humorous ... I wear the badge with pride!

Fill the earth and govern it. Reign over the fish in the sea, the birds in the sky, and all the animals that scurry along the ground.

*Govern* transitive verb
1 a: to exercise continuous sovereign authority over ; especially : to control and direct the making and administration of policy in b: to rule without sovereign power and usually without having the authority to determine basic policy
2 aarchaic : manipulate b: to control the speed of (as a machine) especially by automatic means
3 a: to control, direct, or strongly influence the actions and conduct of b: to exert a determining or guiding influence in or over c: to hold in check : restrain
4: to require (a word) to be in a certain case
5: to serve as a precedent or deciding principle for
intransitive verb
1: to prevail or have decisive influence : control
2: to exercise authority

*reign* intransitive verb
1 a: to possess or exercise sovereign power : rule b: to hold office as chief of state although possessing little governing power
2: to exercise authority in the manner of a monarch
3: to be predominant or prevalent

In short, man controls man's actions and judgments on the earth. The greatest sin (not quoting anybody here) is therefore 'disabling one from making those actions and judgments---disablements up to- and including-murder ('instilling fear' is one of those too, but True Christians--today's Gnostic-Gospellers--know that the true culprits there are those who profit from the 'holding on to the fear of judgment').

---Uncle MythMan (http://www.geocities.com/jmythh2k5) & the Xombies Help You with Money, Love, God etc. Use Your Evolved Mind & GET PAID BY SAVING THE DIALOG STARTERS!

The fuss is about the birth certificate. Let me sum it up for you.

In the State of Hawaii, you can receive a "birth certificate" even if you were not born in the state. The long-version certification of live birth (the "vault" form) is the document that could settle the debate. That form contains all of the important stuff - like which hospital you were born in, the signatures of both parents and witnesses/doctors, the reason for filing a form late (if applicable), etc.

If it turns out that Obama was not born in Hawaii - even though he has a birth certificate by Hawaii - then that raises the question about two things: 1) Is he considered a "natural born" citizen, and 2) is he eligible for the presidency?

According to immigration and naturalization laws at the time of his birth, if he was born outside the United States, he would not be an automatic citizen at birth. The law required that if born outside the United States by one citizen parent and one non-citizen parent, the citizen parent had to meet specific qualifications to extend "at birth" citizenship. The citizen parent had to be a citizen at the time of birth for at least five years after the age of fourteen. That means Obama's mother - the citizen parent - had to be 19 years old. But she was only 18 and therefore could not extend citizenship status to her son at birth.

This means Obama would have to have been naturalized...which would make him ineligible to serve as president, since that position requires one to be a "natural born" citizen.

But all of this speculation would go away if Obama simply released his original vault records. At this point, he has refused every request to do so.

Does that help answer your question about the "fuss"?

Who is Publius?
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I just can't believe some people. I am certain the man is a native born american I don't even think his nationality would be a question if the guy was white. I'm sorry if I offend any with this comment, but I think I am right, and it is only an opinion. I find the entire subject of his origin to be outragously stupid. I do care whether he is or not, but I think the white house has that covered. Especially with all the questions about it.

As for his religion. That part I don't care about. It is his right as an american to practice, preach or studied what ever religion he wants. Maybe he did practice the muslim religion once, maybe he invested some time studying it. Maybe it embarrasses him to talk about it. Maybe he really never did and everyone has this whole thing blown out of proportion, because they don't like him for whatever reason entirely of their own choosing. maybe it isn't that he is black , but instead some people don't like hime because: they believe him to be to thin to, young, or whatever.

Sorry to hear that. I'm also sorry to reveal the sad truth. Your side lost the presidential election. Better luck next round.

I've read ridiculous tales of him being the antichrist because his name obama means lightening. I personally think these people are nuts. Again, my opinion.

I'm certain he has to prove his origin of birth before getting sworn in. I'm glad obama is president. It should give all americans a sense of hope and peace, instead the only thing we can do is bicker about his nationality. I don't think he would have gotten this far if he was unable to prove what country he was born in.

How many of you who are pitting this ridiculous debate have run for president of the united states? I know I haven't, but when I was signing up for the military I had to prove I was a american or I couldn't get in. I'm certain anyone who has been through the proceedures of signing up for the service knows what it takes to get in. I'm certain they are even more careful about elected officials getting into the presidential office.

Sure the white house politicians may seem like a load of classclowns only after our money. However, I don't think they want someone who can't verify their origin of birth inside the presidential office either.

Can we give the man a real chance? Do we always have to have some sort of wild goose chase every presidential election? It doesn't matter who gets elected really, you can't please everyone. The only important part is that he proves his origin of native birth to the white house which will then show everyone else.

Reverend Conner
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You can "think" and "believe" whatever you like, but that does not make it fact. And this has nothing to do with "nationality" - it has to do with the law and the constitutional requirements for the presidency.

Your assumption that everyone in the military has to be a proven citizen doesn't really give me much confidence in the system...since there have been several cases of illegal aliens serving. I also know that when I joined, I only had to produce a certified copy of a birth certificate, not an original, long version "vault" form.

This is not about winning or losing an election either. The issue was brought up before Obama even received the official nomination from the Democrat Party. It's about upholding the Constitution, who has the legal right to do so, and challenging the eligibility of those who will be running our federal government.

And if Obama has already proven to the "powers-that-be" that he was in fact born in Hawaii, then why doesn't he simply release the document to the lawyers that are challenging him instead of filing for dismissals on technicalities? He can put the entire issue to rest by doing one simple action - providing his "vault" form to any one of the courts that are presiding over any of the multiple cases or the lawyers that are challenging him. I'm hoping he does that and I'm hoping that he was in fact born in Hawaii, otherwise we are facing a serious problem here.

But so far, it appears that he will not release the information unless ordered to and that the document may prove something that he does not want the public to know. So much for being "transparent" and honest with the American People.

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Maybe he is just bull headed and headstrong like most people I meet. At least it shows a strong will if that is the case and a strong sense of his own character. The downside is we don't get to see what his character is truely like. Being bull-headed and headstrong also shows determination, and a very possible ability to advance inspite of what others think of him. Maybe he doesn't think he has anything to prove.

These are all things I run into with people with ironclad wills. Most likely, he probably doesn't like feeling bullied. Do you like being bullied or pushed around, made to try and prove something that you were certain you already proved?

Reverend Conner
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I take it you're not a big fan of the law...or maybe you just don't understand it.

Who is Publius?
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I don't understand you. Doesn't matter. Don't need to. I understand what is happening. I understand the law just fine when it comes the presidential elctions. My government teacher drilled it into my clasmates and myself so we wouldn't have our rights trampled on.

Despite the negative opinions of the few, Obama is and will most likely remain President. I'm glad he is who he is. If he is Iron-Willed then this country has a fighting chance. In the end you will see he is as legal as he is suppose to be to be President of The United States.

Reverend Conner
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