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There is no such a thing as an atheist

posted July 29, 2008 - 10:38am
There is no such a thing as an atheist

For anyone to claim he is one, he must first prove that he is in possession of all the possible, unlimited and total knowledge of everything about the Universe, its existence and functioning, which they cannot claim. On the contrary, an intellectually honest atheist admits that our knowledge of the Universe, its origin, function and existence is limited. Hence, an intellectually honest atheist will admit that he doesn't know whether God exists of not.

An atheist who claims God does not exist, is exercising his belief that what he claims is true, a belief very much like faith. He hopes that eventually one day, God's non existence will be proved. Hope and faith are characteristics of believers. We, Christians believe God exists, atheist believe God doesn't exist. Opposing positions but both in need of profound faith.

There are so many things atheists admit not knowing about the Universe, its coming into existence, its functioning and its physical laws, that they implicitly leave the door open to the possibility that there is someone out there who actually knows everything. We, Christians, believe in the One who knows everything, controls everything and is constantly and continuously involved with everything.

Atheists believe in what can be observed, measured and replicated through either physical senses and/or devices which enhance those senses and/or expose things that our senses cannot perceive. We, Christians believe the same things, plus we acknowledge that there are manifestations of the Creation that cannot be observed, measured and/or reproduced, yet whose existence cannot be denied based on the effect that they produce on the physical realm. The human mind is one of those examples: it is a well known scientific fact, never denied by atheists or Christians, that we use only about one tenth of our brain capacity. What are the other nine tenths for? Do they serve a purpose? And if we could double our brain function capabilities, what new and wonderful manifestation of the mind would become evident? Not to mention using the totality of our brain functions.

Christians hold on to the beliefs that God, the Creator of all things, the possessor of the total possible knowledge in the Universe, His limitless attributes, is a reality that, even as the science today cannot grasp, measure or understand, it cannot deny His existence, by its very limitations. Claiming that something doesn't exist because we cannot measure, detect, see or understand is not scientific.

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Comments

@Martin\Maybe as VegHead Plays in Your Dreams ...

She's an atheist; but HERE she actually said she does not deny God! I'm sure you can take words out of that and do some nerdy 'whell, ya cain't NOT deny God `thout denyin`M furst!' ... just like you you could say 'Jesus couldn't NOT deny Our Father `thout denyin`M furst!' ... signed, Uncle MythMan---Big Fan of the 2008 Olympics, Megan Fox, Laur. Franco, Fussin`, Vanessa Montagne & Lena Li--Xombie Plan

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@veg/martin\"endless mental masturbation about God vs. No God"

We blesséd atheists and -agnostics and -pagans are God's Porn ... the masturbation of the eternal mind! 'It is not good for the man to be alone, (because then--as he is like me--all these feelings would be wrong!) I'll give him a partner (someone to validate his early Gk. ~pornographos~ "writing about prostitutes," ... signed, Uncle MythMan---Big Fan of stars like Tori Spelling, Fussin`, Vanessa Montagne & Lena Li--Xombie Plan

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@veg,Lmo\

the bible also contains all sorts of quotes about the virtues of eating veggies and eschewing (rather than chewing) animal flesh Those are right next to 'the virtues of wife-sharing,' right? ... signed, Uncle MythMan---Big Fan of stars like Tori Spelling, Fussin`, Vanessa Montagne & Lena Li--Xombie Plan

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@princessg Your Praising is Powerful!

Maybe it was that type of praise (praising despite your faculty of reason), maybe it was the public's love of red-headed wisdom; but your praise inspired ME to go up and make sure that I had given Imorovan the '+' he so greatly deserved, a '+' I had forgotten to give him before. Thank you, princessg! ... signed, Uncle MythMan---Big Fan of stars like Tori Spelling, Fussin`, Vanessa Montagne & Lena Li--Xombie Plan

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@veghead You Help Build God

God doesn't "exist" until people make him so. It's 'wherever two- or more of you are gathered in my name, there I will be also'; not 'wherever I am, there you ought to go and hope someone else shows up.' For instance, God is in every church BECAUSE PEOPLE GO THERE TO SEE GOD. Maybe it's important for the children to believe that God's always there, but 'God's always there' like 'you are always on the job.' ... signed, Uncle MythMan---Big Fan of stars like Tori Spelling, Fussin`, Vanessa Montagne & Lena Li--Xombie Plan

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Thank you

Thank you for your compliments! Funny or not, the world is not black and white and I'm not the one dividing agnostics it's just the way it is. unless you're just dropping random comments you should be able to defend your point of view when you make claims like the one which sparked my reaction. I'm not angry I'm just pointing out obvious errors, you seem pretty angry though but it's hard to tell across the web.. by the way, have you heard of a strawman argument? You just made a huge one. Nobody has denied you're agnostic ,but you're also an atheist. My whole point is that these 2 are not necessarily contradictary points of view. An atheist are not usually irrational when it comes to the big question. I guess to you that just made your assumptions about me and my albeit rigid and carefully defined life stronger? well that's fine by me but you're the one resorting to prejudice here...

I make my own definitions, martin

That's pretty funny. So you even divide agnostics into little pieces! How anal can you get? With all due respect, the problem with hard-core atheists like you is that you are angry, defensive, inflexible, and you believe that everything has to go by the book--which are also, curiously enough, characteristics of religious fanatics. I'm not like that. I live by my own rules, and if I define myself as an agnostic, then I'm an agnostic. Period. End of story. This endless mental masturbation about God vs. No God is a bit of a bore. If God exists, fine, if not, fine too. It won't impact how I live my life, either way, and it shouldn't. I'm not looking for the carrot at the end of the stick (i.e., Heaven), I'm just living my life the best way I know how. So good luck to you, Martin, and have a happy, albeit rigid and carefully defined atheist life.

veghead's Xombytes

ateism vs agnosticism

veghead wrote: "they've closed the door on science or philosophy ever finding any basis for an existence of God" It's not semantics it's getting the definitions right so we're talking about the same thing here. Your definition of atheists are wrong,most atheists don't close out the very question of god's existence, I don't and I'm an atheist you don't and you're also an atheist (and agnostic). You're actually partly describing an agnostic in the sentence above here's the definition of a strong agnostic "Strong agnosticism (also called hard agnosticism, closed agnosticism, strict agnosticism, absolute agnosticism)—the view that the question of the existence or nonexistence of an omnipotent God and the nature of ultimate reality is unknowable by reason of our natural inability to verify any experience with anything but another subjective experience." you're a mild agnostic because you don't believe that the question regarding god's existence is unknowable. you'd rather sit on the fence until somebody else digs up some evidence some time in the future.

Agreed, Elmor (small l looks the same as capital i in this font)

FYI, some of the aliases people give themselves are too darn long, so I shorten them. Hey, if you want to call me veg or just head, that's fine with me. I'm not proud. ;) The moral is that the bible is a notoriously bad resource for anything, since it was written by a committee who didn't do much if any consulting with each other and it contradicts itself all over the place. Also, who knows what it originally said because bad translations have made even more of a mess of it. But you lured me away from the real point I was trying to make, that one reason I'm not a Christian (or a Muslim or a Hindu or a Jew) is their encouragement of animal sacrifice (and your handy dandy quote was just one example of that, even though the bible also contains all sorts of quotes about the virtues of eating veggies and eschewing (rather than chewing) animal flesh).

veghead's Xombytes

The irrational part of atheism, Martin

is that, in my view, they've closed the door on science or philosophy ever finding any basis for an existence of God. Because even if it hasn't so far, that doesn't mean it won't at some point in the future, as an agnostic would say (at least, as this agnostic would say). I think that if you say you absolutely don't believe in the existence of God, that's pretty definite. But an agnostic is a sort of theological fence sitter: maybe there is a God and maybe there isn't, it's just an unknown at present. And that's where I sit. So I don't see how an agnostic can be an atheist at the same time--temporary atheist maybe. As for your two sentences, the first is what an atheist would say, and the second is what someone who acknowledges the possible existence of God but doesn't believe in her anyway would say. That's neither agnostic nor atheist, that's something else. Needs a name. Anyway, it's fun to play with the semantics of splitting hairs, but as I said in another comment, God vs. No God isn't the important point, or Heaven vs. No Heaven, for that matter, but rather it's the meaning and ethics of your life while you're here.

veghead's Xombytes

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